Joshua Phillips
.:.SOARING INTO EARTH.:.
An Interview with Joshua Phillips of Echtra, Fauna, and Fearthainne
by Patrick Bertlein
Introduction by S. L. Weatherford
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Of all the impressive musicians that the Pacific Northwest has been able to lay claim to over the past two decades, few have been as down-to-earth, purposely obscure, and philosophically minded as Joshua Phillips. The sole mind behind Echtra and an imperative pillar for both Fauna (Pesanta Urfolk) and Fearthainne (Glass Throat Recordings), Phillips is a unique creature in his outward dedication to family and community, choosing to forego his art for years at a time in order to focus on being a provider as well as taking steps to support his local underground through everything from the yearly Yule gatherings to his help in developing the Stella Natura festival (neither of which is he still a part of). Patrick Bertlein conducted this interview with Phillips over the course of a couple of years, tackling topics ranging from the need for the fall of civilization and the decline of spiritual maturity through our displacement from our natural habitat, to beard-cutting, the human animal, and the late environmental philosopher, Paul Shepard.
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Heathen Harvest: Let’s start off a bit predictably by talking about the name Echtra. Why did you choose this name, and what does it signify? Do you believe your music helps others go on these “underworld” journeys, which from my understanding is the translation of the word Echtra?
Joshua Phillips: “Echtra” is an Irish story-form, a characteristic of which is that the hero in these tales is often mysteriously transported to an otherworld (rather than “underworld”) in the midst of completing daily life tasks. In a sense, they are whisked away from the banality of the everyday and wind up in a different realm, a world that will often exhibit entirely different creatures and physical laws than the world the hero has known. I chose this name for multiple reasons, which include solidifying my connection with ancestral methods of mythic immersion as well as the significance of being taken to an otherworld whilst unthinkingly participating in mundane existence. This is my intention for the Echtra project: that it acts as a doorway (for myself and others), initiating all into participation in something beyond the pale of the profane. The feedback that I have consistently gotten is that, for some individuals, the performances of Echtra—and to a lesser extent the recorded material—do open a portal for trance and other altered states of consciousness.
HH: Your latest album under this moniker, which was released in 2013, is titled “Sky Burial.” What is the significance of this, and is this how you wish to be buried?
JP: The sky burial is a traditional funerary rite of certain Himalayan peoples, in which the deceased are ritually dismembered in a high place before being offered to the elements. In general, these areas are known to carrion, and vultures swarm the body as soon as the attendants offer it, consuming the flesh of the dead.
I don’t know that I foresee this for my remains. I am actually quite drawn to returning to the Earth, being buried and reincorporated by the soil—this land that I am so beholden to. It seems an appropriate offering to give myself back, providing nourishment for manifold biological processes dependent on decay. The resultant regeneration is a gift for a future age.
Joshua Phillips
HH: Your words suggest a yearning for the past. Do you feel modern technological advancements have separated us from something that at some point we understood better (or at all)? Do you praise the ideas of the complete deterioration of civilization, such as “Burn It All Away” might suggest?
JP: Yes, I do. It is, of course, quite a paradoxical position. The eradication of technological mediation, which I perceive as nefarious and an incredibly destructive force in the world, would likely interfere with the distribution of goods and services upon which we all rely. I don’t think that I, nor many that I care deeply about, would be spared. To wish for the collapse of civilization is to wish, in a way, for the demise of much that I hold dear. While this sobering prospect is certainly sorrowful (and at times unthinkable), I possess enough of a passion for the health of the biosphere that the prospect of the “complete deterioration” of human civilization is beautiful for me to contemplate.
HH: Fauna, Fearthainne, and Echtra are three musical spirits which you keep alive. What differs between the three of them? How much of you is in each one, and how much do others impact the creation of all of them?
JP: One way to break this down is in terms of method: Fauna alternates (often quite suddenly) between acoustic and electric aural techniques to induce altered states of consciousness through shock and destabilization of the psyche; Fearthainne is an effort to create music entirely free of dependence on electricity or other hyper-technologized aspects of modernity (in the process facilitating a deeper connection with the whole of the [more-than-human] world); Echtra, on the other hand, weaves the acoustic and electric sounds together simultaneously in an effort to unite the polarities and thus create a more effective inducement to transcendent states. Echtra has always fundamentally been an effort to create music to assist individuals in the attainment of meditative absorption.
Another way that I understand these projects as differentiated from each other is the level of agency that I exert within them. The Echtra realm is entirely my own, and while I have enlisted various others to participate in scripted roles in Echtra’s ritual enactments, the aural world is entirely my creation. Fearthainne is borne from songs that I write, which I then bring to a shifting cast of others to ask for assistance in bringing them fully into form. The skeleton of these works is mine, but they are made flesh (and given much emotional heft) by the contributions of others (sometimes autonomously born and sometimes guided by my hand). Fauna is a fully collaborative endeavor between Echtra and Vines, and is borne of our shared efforts and inspiration. Neither of us has a greater level of investment or control than the other.
HH: What inspired the use of the quote from Paul Shepard contained within the newest Fearthainne album?
JP: Paul Shepard is, to my mind, the most important philosopher of the 20th Century. I refer to him constantly, and am often deeply moved when I read his impassioned defense of the integrity of the human animal. That this man lived is a great gift, and that he offered his perspectives so willingly (in an extremely unfriendly intellectual climate) is a boon for seekers trying to understand our place in this world.
The quote references the role music can play in finding “home,” which has always been a guiding light for my various efforts. The capacity of music to usher in states of consciousness facilitative of healing and growth is quite pronounced; it has always been true for me that particular sound artists have fundamentally changed the way I understand my life and myself.
HH: The newest Fearthainne album is titled “Knowing.” Strangely, the lyrics printed within lack the concept of knowing, and seem to focus on all that is unknown. With so little known and so many questions you seem to be presenting to the listener, why would you choose such an album title? Why so many questions, and are these the right ones to be asking?
JP: They are my questions. I cannot speculate on whether they are the “right” questions to be asking in any kind of determinable sense, but I can say that for my mode of philosophical inquiry these are compelling ontological queries. I am not terribly interested in an empirical effort to “answer” these questions but am more drawn to the full integration of the emotional experience arising from the asking. This is our situation. Continuity has been lost. How do we find a way to make meaning of this travesty?
I aim towards an integrity borne of curiosity, which can act as an antidote to the stultifying reductionism and literalism of this age. One of the implications inhering in the title of this album is that by squarely facing these existential dilemmas, many of them unique to the aberrant context of civilized society, we rescue a certain dimension of humanness that could otherwise be lost. To be willing to dwell within anguished querying can save the soul, and free the heart from the shackles of empiricism.
HH: An ecological aspect of your music is certainly prevalent. Do you think our current situation is hopeless? Is this fear contained in the bones of all your music?
JP: The hopelessness of the current system’s prospects makes me hopeful for the future.
HH: During one particular Fauna performance you handed a new member an object, known as Vajra/Dorje. What was the intent behind using this object as an initiation? Combined with that particular individual’s new band, Sadhana—a Buddhist term—and the mandala on the new Fearthainne, do you care to go into detail on how Buddhism has inspired your music and studies today?
JP: Going into detail would likely be unhelpful to my own journey, as well as the development of your readers. The spiritual path, in our modern context, is a very personal (and often very idiosyncratic) domain, and I would not want to color the consciousness of others in regards to this lineage. What I can say is that Buddhism, and in particular the Vajrayana Buddhism that has been kept alive for the past few centuries in Tibet, is a very simple and direct path to awakening. When my practice turned in this direction, I began to experience a depth of engagement and freedom from materialism that had previously eluded me.
HH: What are your plans for future Fauna and Echtra performances? Will Fearthainne be able to play live now?
JP: I love the idea of continuing to perform, and at the same time recognize the limitations my current lifestyle presents. I am the sole breadwinner for my family, as we strongly recognize the crucial importance of a healthy attachment paradigm for our daughter. It is of the utmost importance that during the first few years human young have unencumbered access to caregivers, and in particular the mother, to healthfully develop functional homeostatic mechanisms for the regulation of arousal. For this reason, I have stepped into the role of “hunter,” leaving the home on a regular basis to “bring home the meat,” which in our current cultural context is money (allowing us to meet our basic biological needs).
That said, Fearthainne and Fauna both manifested at last year’s Yule gathering, and will likely continue to do so sporadically over the years to come. Fauna has been invited to tour Europe on multiple occasions, and while the conceptual task of manifesting the Fauna world on another continent is incredibly daunting, we are drawn to actualizing this vision in the next couple years. Echtra will likely never perform live again, though I cannot definitively say that this is the case.
Fearthainne
HH: In one interview, you directly said “we are animals,” as in Homo sapiens. Considering this, how do you feel ideas of repressing our animal senses fits into our greater spiritual place in the world? Should we not—crudely put—have sex, eat meat, and scream like primal beings? The concept of us as animals and as evolved beings seems to be contradictory (though I’m not saying you stated the latter).
JP: My emphasis on our place in the kingdom Animalia is necessary for the philosophical imperative I embody, but I would not want to create an artificial duality between the animal and the cultural. The caricature of the primal you offer here, with all the requisite carnality and aggression, is largely a fantasy of civilization. Our ancestors were pacific beings, who dynamically expressed a wide behavioral repertoire, our inheritance of which inclines us towards the same potentialities of violence, empathy, and an indwelling sense of justice (to name but a few of our evolutionarily predetermined behavioral orientations). We are always and forever both that which cannot be tamed, and a wisdom borne of millennia of experimentation and refinement.
HH: Your musical works and live ceremonies have greatly impacted various individuals, although a distinct few (myself included to some degree). What are your thoughts on having an impact on others’ lives, in particular in regards to a spiritual sense?
JP: It fulfills a certain prophecy that arose simultaneously with the birth of Echtra. The only terminology I can find to describe this is “ministry,” though this is certainly a problematic term. I see this “art” as part of a larger war I am fighting for the Soul of this World. I am told that a certain individual who attended Echtra’s first manifestation (in 2003, at the seminal Unburied gathering in Olympia, Washington) was literally saved by the experience, which is to say that he had planned his suicide for some time shortly after this date but was moved by the experience to set a different course. Something in that environment breathed some kind of meaning or purpose into the devastated terrain of this person’s interior landscape. That this individual later went on to create enormously inspiring works of art themselves was certainly awe-inspiring for me, and left me feeling grateful that I had initially taken the risk of manifesting in that way. My goal is to humbly accept that the spirits breathing through my hands have work to do, and not to get caught up in the egoic pursuit of achievement in this domain.
HH: What are your thoughts on gurus, and the actions of Chogyam Trungpa in particular (speaking of the public humiliation of others, heavily drinking, and having sex with young women, all of which are documented)?
JP: In short: the guru can be a necessary component of the spiritual path, particularly in cultural contexts that are more hierarchical.
The guru is simply the human individual who represents the lineage, the procession of teachers over numberless generations, who can embody the teachings and create for the seeker a personal connection with wisdom traditions. The West may not be a good seedbed for this dimension of Eastern mysticism, as we see the corrupting influence of this kind of power and domination in this culture enacted again and again. At the same time, finding an individual that makes the dharma available to you through the compatibility of their teachings with your personal karmic situation can be lifesaving.
The entity known as Chögyam Trungpa cannot be grasped through historicity or moralistic wrangling. The immense importance of this particular teacher, and the lineage of crazy wisdom he represents, lies outside the confines of a reasoned effort to summate his life or compare his behavior with what he taught. For anyone even remotely interested in the Venerable Chogyam Trungpa, Rinpoche, I would recommend reading his texts and listening to his recorded talks rather than reading the sensationalized histories widely available about him.
HH: The live ceremonies of Fauna were never quite explained. What was the reason for doing these in public at all? Do you think, even to those who could misconstrue such events as purely “Satanic,” these ceremonies could still have a positive impact?
JP: I cannot, as but one-half of the project, speak for Fauna. I can, however, certainly relate this question to my experience with Echtra (though at various points Echtra was accused of being Satanic as well as having a Christian subtext!).
The reasons for manifesting live are multifold and include the desire to create a space for the growth and transformation of others, the need to honor the spirits and entities I see as co-collaborators by making these sacrificial offerings, and to avoid any tendency to begin making art for art’s sake. I tend to distrust musical entities that have no live “show” or performance dimension, as this is suggestive to me of a lack of commitment to one’s craft and the full ramifications of the creative impulse. The creation and dissemination of recorded music is almost wholly uninteresting to me, and should be abandoned in favor of enactments that transform the physical environments in which we dwell. The abstraction of modern life is one of the primary things I seek to banish, and this requires putting the body into action to accomplish the transformation of the World.
HH: Is the same tree on the cover of both Fearthainne albums?
JP: No. They are neighbors, though, inhabiting a largely cedar forest area that is like a church to me, which is in the process of regeneration after being cut previously. This area is located in the forest behind the Evergreen State College, which all of the original members of Fearthainne attended.
HH: What role does Johnny/Vines play on your multiple musical endeavors? He is clearly your musical partner; does he also have a role in the creation of the music, or trust you to create it completely from your own vision?
JP: We can reference the question above related to the level of agency I have within the various projects. Vines and Echtra (as beings) are together responsible for the vision and execution of the Fauna project at all levels, which includes composition of the music and visioning related to live events. Vines filled important roles in various Echtra live rites, but has never been involved in the music creation or visioning processes Echtra involves. Fearthainne, as mentioned previously, is borne of songs I wrote to which parts were added, and the force behind Vines has been an enormously important part of this process.
HH: You clearly have a strong interest in rain, which is understandable considering your location. What are your thoughts on how rain has led to the creation of the Earth, the thousands (if not more) of years where it rained all around the world non-stop? Do you see this as a cleansing we are in desperate need of?
JP: Cleansing is certainly a theme that inspires me. The obsessive interest in rain, however, stems largely from an embrace of our surroundings rather than any symbolic capacities of these “tears from the sky.” My impulse is to enter the here and now, allowing consciousness to worm its way into the heart of meaning and depth, found in the unrecognized majesty of what surrounds us. Echtra has always focused on ancestral connections; my blood lineage is from dreary, rainy environments, and this aesthetic informs my philosophic and artistic movements.
HH: Both Fearthainne albums feature a child being held by a member. Is this intentional?
JP: Yes, in a way. It certainly would have been possible to have the little ones off-camera when these shots were taken, but my perspective is that Fearthainne is as much a movement toward familial bonding as it is a band. The very first Fearthainne “band photo,” in fact, had eight individuals in it, some of which were in no way connected to the production of musical sounds the project created. It is perhaps unfortunate that this “tribe” suffered significant ruptures, making the continuation of this larger familial theme untenable. What is important to emphasize, perhaps, is that the project is not necessarily about the individuals creating the music, but about the way in which these currents manifest as life itself.
HH: I recall an image in the first Fearthainne album that quite struck me. It featured a number of people standing around a fire—an image of community, of tribe. How relevant is this for you and the words you produce, in particular opening yourself up to others through ceremony? Many of these performances had some form of communal element—a bowl of water or some other shared substance to consume. I’m reminded distinctly of the Othala rune, which you may be familiar with. Certainly, place is directly tied in with the people of that place.
JP: Tribe is central to the way humans manifest in this world, and as can be seen in the “Knowing” manifesto of questioning, I see the lack of tribal affiliation inherent in modern life as a central disfigurement of our existence. A single mother—without significant extended family—raised me, and the unsatisfactory nature of this experience clearly demonstrated to me the unsustainability of these impoverished family structures. So, yes, this is another important dimension of the live ceremony: joining together in a kind of communion, a temporary dissolution of the aching isolation this world demands. Unfortunately, the limitation of performance as a one-way conveyance of feeling and information is prohibitive of interactive and spontaneous ritualizing, which is something I hope to address in the future.
Place is deterministic in our understanding of ourselves, and as such conditions what is possible for mentation. An artful affiliation with the phenomenal world demands reciprocity, and this understanding is central to the ritual structures inhering in all the projects in which I participate.
Joshua Phillips
HH: From what I understand, both Fauna’s “Avifauna” and Echtra’s “Sky Burial” were ready for release for some time before they came out. If this is true, why the wait?
JP: Both Avifauna and Sky Burial were initiated in 2007, with the first performances of Avifauna happening that year and the sole performance of Sky Burial occurring in 2008. These projects were completed many years before they were released, and this trend continues today. I am at the moment preparing Echtra’s BardO for release; it was completed in 2008, and it is now fully seven years later. The reasons for these delays include the fact that I fundamentally don’t care about album releases, the limitations of being a busy modern person who derives no income from these artistic outlets, and the tendency to prioritize the enactment of new ritual processes over the arduous work of refining and rehashing old material. It is perhaps unfortunate that I am both uninterested in album releases and a perfectionist, as this means that I am unmotivated to complete the labor necessary to create an album I see as worthy of being released to the world.
HH: The live aspects of Fauna have changed dramatically, with Vines moving to drums and various other individuals joining you on stage. Along with this, it seems to be a much more forward band approach with less ritual. Indeed, what is commonly referred to as “corpse paint” is now gone. What does the future for Fauna hold in terms of the live ritual? Surely the days of long beards are gone, but will such performances return, or does Fauna remain a full band with more focus on live performance as opposed to a ritual performance (of course, this does not have to be in opposition; the intention may remain the same with merely the aesthetic having changed)?
JP: Beard length aside, the Fauna beast seems to arise at the oddest times. I’ve many times come to the conclusion that Fauna is complete, or at least on some kind of extended hiatus, when it somehow resurrects itself. The world created for Fauna’s expression and exploration remains intact, and we continue to open that portal. We will continue to do so into the indefinite future, though our appearances will likely be less frequent and reflect participation only in those events that feel are wholly congruent with our aspirations.
HH: Will performances of “Rain” and “The Hunt” ever return, or is this a part of a past that only a few will ever stand witness to?
JP: This is highly unlikely, though I couldn’t say anything definitive.
HH: In regards to the ceremony, one of Fauna’s performances, which I unfortunately missed, consisted of the members getting their beards cut. Why do this live, and what is the significance of sharing such a thing with an audience?
JP: That’s a great question. I’ve pondered the same myself, and have come up with differing conclusions. Again, I cannot speak on behalf of Fauna, so this is more related to my experience within this happening.
Before full beards became an appendage of every hipster in Portland, the members of Fauna were quite rogue in the way they allowed their bodily hair to grow unencumbered. The philosophical paradigm of Echtra, which was also embraced by Fauna, emphasizes allowing the animal body to have a voice in the unfolding of one’s life path. To not domesticate one’s face became part of this imperative. Eventually, though, it became clear that being in possession of that beard had become an encumbrance on Echtra’s spiritual quest, in the sense that the ego had become over-identified with the form. It was recognized that there was a need to be more brazen in one’s encounter with phenomena, and pursue a kind of nakedness that reflects an embrace of the fundamental groundlessness inhering in existence.
As to why this occurred publicly, I can only speak for myself. I perceived a need for recognition of the transition that was occurring internally, to be seen symbolically shedding the barriers between my form and the other manifold beings that populate our sphere. It was shortly after this that Fauna removed our corpse paint, which also occurred as part of a public ritual. There was something deeply cathartic about coming out from behind the various masks that had provided protection previously, and coming forward to be perceived sans obscurations. Liberation was had, and the fact that beards and corpse paint have returned signal to me that the integration sought through this transformation has been achieved.
HH: The Yule MMVI book that was gifted to the gathering’s participants contained the words “The voice of the animals whispers, it is who we were born to be.” This suggests an idea that flies in the face of evolution—that we have, in a sense, fallen. What are your thoughts on this, and do you care to explain this idea further?
JP: I believe the specific quote you’re referencing makes this a Fauna-related question, though I can certainly speak a few words on the devolution principle. While not in any sense a fall from grace, our entrenchment in civilization has deformed human consciousness, creating what Paul Shepard has called “the gradual peeling back of the psyche.” What he meant to signify by this is that as civilization developed and intensified, it created a scenario in which few (if any) individuals actually complete the ontogenetic imperative of the human organism. To render this in less obtuse language: people in the modern world don’t get to mature psychologically. The various forces arrayed against the development of sagacity keep people stunted. Many individuals reach “old age” without developing the requisite wisdom to become elders, instead pursuing selfish ends in a manner more appropriate to the young. Perhaps the most tragic symbol of this stymieing of development is the ubiquitous neglect and abuse that children suffer at the hands of their parents. Say what you will about animal awareness, but you will never see a mother of any other species neglect or abuse her progeny (unless they are either a domesticated animal or a wild animal in confinement). The way in which large masses of people congeal together without the requisite maturity to maintain fulfilling and reciprocal relationships creates the devolution of which I speak, leaving modern humans vulnerable to the behavioral sink of the modern city and the various forms of psychopathology riddling the modern mind.
HH: Meditation is an obvious aspect of your work, including the trance-inducing qualities of your music. Dismissing the idea of time as linear, as you seem to do, is meditation a tool for connecting with a perceived past animal self that is at the same time our foreboding or, perhaps, transcending future? Is this current connection with a past self a future that could perhaps create suffering, if we are not prepared for such an endeavor?
JP: I don’t think I’m entirely clear on this question, but I can affirm that meditation practice is useful for transcending the limited, small self. One aspect of what we encounter as we move beyond these impediments is the wisdom of the flesh; perhaps it is this that you refer to as an “animal self”? Recovering the truth of our being is complex, of course, but we can say undeniably that an authentic spiritual life is inherently somatic.
HH: An aspect of criticism in the new age is the guidance towards other metaphysical worlds without the words of warning. Paths such as Kundalini are known for being horrific to some, and simply blissful to others. Do you feel a sense of responsibility in making sure no one gets lost on the journey your music opens for them?
JP: I have faith that any encounter with truth will eventuate in something useful for the soul’s unfolding.
Fauna
HH: Is there an aspect of romanticizing the past when people discuss the horrors of the present world? Having simple vaccines has certainly led to a world of difference, and I am sure many appreciate the modern sewer system. Do you believe in living absolutely primitive?
JP: To be honest, I tire of this question. It is often the first accusation on people’s lips when one discusses the unsuitability of civilization for the kind of animal we are. Romanticizing? Hardly. To take an honest look at where we’re at is difficult, and challenges many deeply held delusions about the myth of progress, but it is neither naïve nor “romantic” to take stock of the human animal’s descent into collective madness in the modern era. It should be axiomatic that we are not in the environment we evolved over millions of years to thrive within, and that this inevitably creates consequences for physical and mental health. Yes, we have vaccines, but our quality of life has gone down immeasurably. Of what “good” is the continuance of biological processes when the soul has been banished? Why would the longevity of particular members of our species be used to arbitrate questions of human life-way? The modern sewer system only makes sense in the context of human densities that are bizarrely aberrant, and which can never serve the full unfolding of human consciousness.
HH: The bitter irony of all discussions involving the future of the planet is that it has more to do with our survival than the planet as a whole, as discussed by William Ashworth. We obviously have had, and will continue to have a tragic relationship with our host planet. With this idea in mind, what is the role of the human animal? Would it perhaps be best if things continue as they are, leaving a wounded Earth which is rid of this “pest,” as it is inevitable we could not survive if we continue down this trajectory? Is there a better way?
JP: Animals like us lived on this planet for millions of years without engaging in a frenzy of denudation, and there is absolutely no reason to suppose that this is some kind of fundamental feature of human consciousness. It’s fear; civilization breeds fear, is born from fear. As long as the fundamental conditions of domestication remain unquestioned, yes, civilized humans will continue to destroy the world. Once we recover ourselves, and the dissociative disconnection from phenomena yields, we will find ourselves in a world worth loving.
HH: Being that performing has been said by you to be of such high importance, why so few live settings? I doubt you have done a public ceremony more than twenty times.
JP: Every time, it’s been a major undertaking that required weeks, months, or years of preparations. Given that I do not derive any income from these works, it has been necessary to procure wages through other professional endeavors. As much as I might like to be a full-time “creator,” I have had to temper my artistic impulse in order to satisfy the requirements of being of service to my family and community. This fulfills the highest imperative of my life, and while I certainly want to continue creating public spectacles of ritual art into the indefinite future, it is not the sole priority of my existence.
HH: A few of your close friends have been incarcerated due to the “green-scare.” Recognizing the need to watch words regarding such a topic, what thoughts would you like to share? Why is it that the Yule events will no longer continue, now that these individuals thankfully are no longer locked up?
JP: The questions for this interview were generated some time ago; as you’ll notice, Yule events have continued. My participation in planning, programming, and managing these events ceased as of 2012. This was a year of finality, and involved bringing into being the final Yule (in the manifestation it had assumed for the previous eight years), the final Echtra performance rite, and other conclusive events in my life. It was also the year that my daughter was born, and my sense is that these beginnings and endings are not unrelated. Others have taken the energy my partner and I initiated with the Yule events and carried it forward, and while the new manifestation of Yule definitely expresses a different spirit, I’m heartened to see a continuation of this impulse into the indefinite future.
HH: You were a big part of the first Stella Natura; what are your thoughts on it now?
JP: Yes, I co-founded Stella Natura and managed the first gathering. It was a brilliant experience, though seriously marred by some poor planning and deceit on the part of my collaborator. He subsequently took the event in a very different direction, and seems to have omitted my participation from his narrative of Stella Natura’s development. I did not go to any of the subsequent gatherings, and heard very mixed things from others who did attend. I would not be involved in Stella Natura in the future. [Editor’s Note: Stella Natura ceased operating after its final event in September 2013.]
HH: Lastly, Washington State is founded on the logging industry. Growing up here, you might have many memories of seeing clear-cuts during your travels. What role does this play in your music, and in your development as an individual?
JP: This is part of the great tragedy of being alive at this time, to see the destructiveness of a culture dissociated from the ground of Being, and I’m certain that the psychic scars of bearing witness to the rape of our Earth has disfigured my awareness. The music is, in addition to being many other things, mourning for the death of the World. It’s horrifying to be forced to see such unnatural devastation, akin to staring into the sun.
Heathen Harvest 
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